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Post by Jemma Simmons on Feb 22, 2017 13:55:45 GMT
So I'm still wrapping my brain around the episode. Here's my early morning take on the Maytrix stuff. I'm interested to see what everyone else thinks.
So we were told the Darkhold removed one regret. Regrets are painful, so we find ways to cope or avoid that behaviour or issue. So, for example, Fitz feels incredible guilt over the damage his working on Aida had (and to a lesser extent, still being so trusting after multiple betrayals). In the Maytrix, it doesn't seem like this bothers him. I'm wondering if this is how it will play out for everyone there. If so, our girls may have a tough time convincing the rest to leave, because things certainly feel better for those Aida's altered reality for.
Jus scattered ideas. Thoughts?
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Post by bigvanray on Feb 22, 2017 14:06:06 GMT
Pain can be the driving factor in a person's growth. It can motivate them to move in directions they would otherwise shy away from. I think May realizes that, and her decoy saw the difference in Coulson's LMD.
Some members of my local AA group said they looked at me and the shape I was in when I got there and thought, "That boy's not going to make it." Another fellow told me he saw the hurt in my eyes and knew I would, that the pain I was in would drive my progress. I've been sober for 19 years, and much better able to deal with life.
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Post by Jemma Simmons on Feb 22, 2017 14:13:55 GMT
Pain can be the driving factor in a person's growth. It can motivate them to move in directions they would otherwise shy away from. I think May realizes that, and her decoy saw the difference in Coulson's LMD. Some members of my local AA group said they looked at me and the shape I was in when I got there and thought, "That boy's not going to make it." Another fellow told me he saw the hurt in my eyes and knew I would, that the pain I was in would drive my progress. I've been sober for 19 years, and much better able to deal with life. What a wonderful personal analogy! (And I'm so happy for you that you came out on the other side of it!). What you said is exactly what I was hinting at. Thank you for making my meaning more clear! |
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Post by backroadjunkie on Feb 22, 2017 14:28:23 GMT
Regrets are painful, so we find ways to cope or avoid that behaviour or issue. So, for example, Fitz feels incredible guilt over the damage his working on Aida had (and to a lesser extent, still being so trusting after multiple betrayals). In the Maytrix, it doesn't seem like this bothers him. I'm wondering if this is how it will play out for everyone there. In the Framework, he may just not care. Think Tony Stark pre-Iron Man, or some of the stuff Howard did. Develop the tech without regard to consequences. If he doesn't care, then no guilt, right? The Darkhold is evil. Think evil.  |
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Post by terminator22 on Feb 22, 2017 14:37:18 GMT
The next episode will be very frustrating to watch. Everyone will want to stay in the framework because their lives are much better there. Get ready for a ton of soap opera stuff....
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Post by backroadjunkie on Feb 22, 2017 14:58:19 GMT
The next episode will be very frustrating to watch. Everyone will want to stay in the framework because their lives are much better there. Get ready for a ton of soap opera stuff.... You're assuming those in the Framework *know* they're in the framework. Do you think they'd be okay with being knowingly kidnapped and put into an alternate reality? I have to assume they don't. Daisy's (and Jemma's) job will be to convince them they're not and to fight their way out. Their other objective is to find out where they're storing the bodies. |
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Post by terminator22 on Feb 22, 2017 15:12:18 GMT
If the world is good enough, some of them might want to stay. It's like that guy in The Matrix movie. He got out of the matrix, and when he realized how terrible his real life is, he did everything he could to get back INTO the Matrix. Daisy has one heck of a challenge on her hands.
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Post by nillindeiel on Feb 22, 2017 15:19:57 GMT
If the world is good enough, some of them might want to stay. It's like that guy in The Matrix movie. He got out of the matrix, and when he realized how terrible his real life is, he did everything he could to get back INTO the Matrix. Daisy has one heck of a challenge on her hands. How good can the world really be though with Hydra in place of SHIELD? |
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Post by b4icuhang on Feb 22, 2017 15:35:22 GMT
I agree. Jemma and Daisy will struggle to convince the others ands may have to fight they're own desires to stay, depending on their lives.
The interesting thing is that, in the framework, Jemma's supposedly dead, but at the same time, she had an avatar waiting. That's interesting.
Plus the fact that Shield is Hydra in the framework. I'm trying to understand how this would be acceptable to someone like May. Her 'regret change' seems to be Ba'Haran (the little girl), which is later in life. You'd think she'd be too grounded in Shield to accept Hydra. It's different than Phil, who apparently was never a Shield agent.
And the fact that Daisy and Grant are a couple? Why? You'd have thought it would be Lincoln. Though with the Hydra connection, it makes some sense. What I don't understand is what would be Daisy's regret? She doesn't regret Ward. She might still want Hive, but this wouldn't be him. It was an interesting twist, along with Hydra, but I'm just have to see where they're going.
Either way, they got us talking.
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Post by b4icuhang on Feb 22, 2017 15:43:42 GMT
If the world is good enough, some of them might want to stay. It's like that guy in The Matrix movie. He got out of the matrix, and when he realized how terrible his real life is, he did everything he could to get back INTO the Matrix. Daisy has one heck of a challenge on her hands. How good can the world really be though with Hydra in place of SHIELD? My thoughts exactly in a post below this. I can understand Phil accepting. He's now no longer a Shield agent. And Fitz and Mack have also never been in Shield. Kind of looks like Fitz went the way of Tony Stark. But May or Daisy? Just don't see it. I'm intrigued about who Jemma is? Looks like she faked her death for some reason. Otherwise, why would she have an avatar waiting? |
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Post by nillindeiel on Feb 22, 2017 15:56:53 GMT
I agree. Jemma and Daisy will struggle to convince the others ands may have to fight they're own desires to stay, depending on their lives. The interesting thing is that, in the framework, Jemma's supposedly dead, but at the same time, she had an avatar waiting. That's interesting. Plus the fact that Shield is Hydra in the framework. I'm trying to understand how this would be acceptable to someone like May. Her 'regret change' seems to be Ba'Haran (the little girl), which is later in life. You'd think she'd be too grounded in Shield to accept Hydra. It's different than Phil, who apparently was never a Shield agent. And the fact that Daisy and Grant are a couple? Why? You'd have thought it would be Lincoln. Though with the Hydra connection, it makes some sense. What I don't understand is what would be Daisy's regret? She doesn't regret Ward. She might still want Hive, but this wouldn't be him. It was an interesting twist, along with Hydra, but I'm just have to see where they're going. Either way, they got us talking. Regarding what I bolded, I might be wrong... but the thing to remember about the 'regret' thing was that that was Aida who removed one regret for those that had been placed in the Framework (she says as much to Radcliffe). Since Aida had no part in Daisy and Jemma hacking in, their situations might not be in regards to any regrets that they personally had/have. Their situations might have to do more with the changes that occurred when Aida removed the regret of the others that she did have control over (so May, Coulson, Mack, Mace and Fitz) |
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Post by b4icuhang on Feb 22, 2017 16:03:56 GMT
I agree. Jemma and Daisy will struggle to convince the others ands may have to fight they're own desires to stay, depending on their lives. The interesting thing is that, in the framework, Jemma's supposedly dead, but at the same time, she had an avatar waiting. That's interesting. Plus the fact that Shield is Hydra in the framework. I'm trying to understand how this would be acceptable to someone like May. Her 'regret change' seems to be Ba'Haran (the little girl), which is later in life. You'd think she'd be too grounded in Shield to accept Hydra. It's different than Phil, who apparently was never a Shield agent. And the fact that Daisy and Grant are a couple? Why? You'd have thought it would be Lincoln. Though with the Hydra connection, it makes some sense. What I don't understand is what would be Daisy's regret? She doesn't regret Ward. She might still want Hive, but this wouldn't be him. It was an interesting twist, along with Hydra, but I'm just have to see where they're going. Either way, they got us talking. Regarding what I bolded, I might be wrong... but the thing to remember about the 'regret' thing was that that was Aida who removed one regret for those that had been placed in the Framework (she says as much to Radcliffe). Since Aida had no part in Daisy and Jemma hacking in, their situations might not be in regards to any regrets that they personally had/have. Their situations might have to do more with the changes that occurred when Aida removed the regret of the others that she did have control over (so May, Coulson, Mack, Mace and Fitz) But the avatars were waiting for them, already in the framework. The only thing I could draw was that neither Daisy or Jemma have been scanned. Maybe Aida doesn't knew yet what their regret would be. She only has data obtained from their friends. It's an interesting twist. |
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Post by koos on Feb 22, 2017 17:51:18 GMT
Jus scattered ideas. Thoughts? Too bad we didn't get to see what year you died. Why are you dead in the framework? Is it because the first loading up failed? Robofitz promised you and him would be happy married in the framework. That doesn't really work when you are dead. Other thoughts: clearly a lot can be explained by Coulson not joining Shield Fitz and Mack have the most loose when they would get out of the Framework. Who is the mysterious woman with Fitz? Would we know her? What exactly was his regret? Just a few scattered thought of mine for now. Have to let it sink in. |
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Post by NorrinRaddOfZennla on Feb 22, 2017 18:38:57 GMT
So I'm still wrapping my brain around the episode. Here's my early morning take on the Maytrix stuff. I'm interested to see what everyone else thinks. So we were told the Darkhold removed one regret. Regrets are painful, so we find ways to cope or avoid that behaviour or issue. So, for example, Fitz feels incredible guilt over the damage his working on Aida had (and to a lesser extent, still being so trusting after multiple betrayals). In the Maytrix, it doesn't seem like this bothers him. I'm wondering if this is how it will play out for everyone there. If so, our girls may have a tough time convincing the rest to leave, because things certainly feel better for those Aida's altered reality for. Jus scattered ideas. Thoughts? Hopefully if each of the now Frameworked characters is true to their real-life core consciousness Daisy and Jemma just have to convince that one person who is the heart of the team to want to leave the Framework because they know it's not real and they know they don't want to be there. For Phil it has to be the mission. SHIELD was formed to protect mankind from the weirder world which is happening to all those NOT in the Framework. The Framework is unsustainable for any period of time because it has to continually create change and or randomness. The individual consciousness and the collective consciousness would eventually figure it out that the Framework construct isn't real. Phil was recruited and decided to serve SHIELD for the good of society and not for the good of himself. Daisy has a mission that is fueled by what she feels is Fitz's and Simmon's destiny. They are destined to be together. It will be up to Daisy and Jemma as Ward (my speculation) to convince Fitz to want to leave because he has to save Jemma so that they are together in life and hopefully Fitz doesn't convince himself that he needs to die in the framework in order to fulfill that fate. The show has set-up some interesting What-Ifs. Just my random thoughts. I'll have to re-watch it again. To expand on my silliness. |
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Post by aquaangel on Feb 22, 2017 18:52:41 GMT
Could the woman in the car be Leo's mom? Like maybe she didn't die?
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