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Post by caseyrook AKA Mechelle on Dec 27, 2017 23:19:04 GMT
Enoch said he could not interfere...until there was the threat of a extinction level event. You know, when he said that, what went through my mind was, "We understand the importance of not interfering with other cultures, but we aren't gonna be stupid about it and make it a driving principle as in a 'Prime Directive' ala Star Trek, with all their violations of THAT rule. At least the chronicons?? sp?? (Enoch's people) have a sensible view of the situation. Having a law like that just invites non-compliance...how are you gonna go explore new worlds and new civilizations without having an influence? Yeah, any replies should probably be directed to the Star Trek board. I don't mean to digress here. I just got tired of the Prime Directive plot lines that are set up for failure. Going off topic (I'm the OP here and I don't care) if you think about the Prime Directive in terms of the ST universe itself and forget the meta level, it only exists because Archer got himself in so much trouble everywhere he went. I'd say he was worse than Kirk but Kirk *did* have rules to prevent him from getting in trouble. I like the concept of the PD, but not so much the actual implementation of it. Now, getting back on topic, yes, Enoch and his people have the right idea to interfere when entire races of people will be wiped out... |
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Post by Hari Seldon on Dec 28, 2017 0:13:21 GMT
You know, when he said that, what went through my mind was, "We understand the importance of not interfering with other cultures, but we aren't gonna be stupid about it and make it a driving principle as in a 'Prime Directive' ala Star Trek, with all their violations of THAT rule. At least the chronicons?? sp?? (Enoch's people) have a sensible view of the situation. Having a law like that just invites non-compliance...how are you gonna go explore new worlds and new civilizations without having an influence? Yeah, any replies should probably be directed to the Star Trek board. I don't mean to digress here. I just got tired of the Prime Directive plot lines that are set up for failure. Going off topic (I'm the OP here and I don't care) if you think about the Prime Directive in terms of the ST universe itself and forget the meta level, it only exists because Archer got himself in so much trouble everywhere he went. I'd say he was worse than Kirk but Kirk *did* have rules to prevent him from getting in trouble. I like the concept of the PD, but not so much the actual implementation of it. Now, getting back on topic, yes, Enoch and his people have the right idea to interfere when entire races of people will be wiped out... Since you've given the OP level permission... I can think of two TNG examples off the top of my head where Picard was willing to let cultures become extinct in the name of the Prime Directive - 'Pen Pals' where Data was on the ham radio talking to a very young Nikki Cox whose planet was falling apart, and the one with Worf's adoptive brother where the planet had some sort of electrical storms that were wiping out the population, but Worf's brother had been observing the culture so closely that he'd knocked up one of the natives. |
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Post by caseyrook AKA Mechelle on Dec 28, 2017 0:30:16 GMT
Going off topic (I'm the OP here and I don't care) if you think about the Prime Directive in terms of the ST universe itself and forget the meta level, it only exists because Archer got himself in so much trouble everywhere he went. I'd say he was worse than Kirk but Kirk *did* have rules to prevent him from getting in trouble. I like the concept of the PD, but not so much the actual implementation of it. Now, getting back on topic, yes, Enoch and his people have the right idea to interfere when entire races of people will be wiped out... Since you've given the OP level permission... I can think of two TNG examples off the top of my head where Picard was willing to let cultures become extinct in the name of the Prime Directive - 'Pen Pals' where Data was on the ham radio talking to a very young Nikki Cox whose planet was falling apart, and the one with Worf's adoptive brother where the planet had some sort of electrical storms that were wiping out the population, but Worf's brother had been observing the culture so closely that he'd knocked up one of the natives. Yep, and both times someone went to Picard and was basically like, "Dude..." causing the Captain to be like, "Fine." |
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Post by DoTheMath on Dec 28, 2017 1:39:20 GMT
I rewatched 'Rewind' and now I'm confused. If Robin's first prophecy is what led to Enoch sending the team to 2091 and leaving Fitz behind, then what was the point of her second prophecy about him saving the team? Something must have changed in the future to warrant the second prophecy? Is anyone else confused? It's all one prophecy. The question(s) is/are: Is Robin holding on to vital information until it's needed? or Is she being spoon fed the information by her "gift?" Enoch obviously doesn't know anything until he gets it from Robin, so the answers reside with her and/or her gift. And yes, like you, I hope the writers/show runners properly flesh this out. |
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Post by koos on Dec 28, 2017 1:52:24 GMT
I rewatched 'Rewind' and now I'm confused. If Robin's first prophecy is what led to Enoch sending the team to 2091 and leaving Fitz behind, then what was the point of her second prophecy about him saving the team? Something must have changed in the future to warrant the second prophecy? Is anyone else confused? There is only one prophecy. And with the last drawing of Robin where Fitz is needed to save the team he becomes a part of that prophecy. In short: The team saves the world and Fitz saves the team. So, Enoch helps him now too. Yup Is Robin holding on to vital information until it's needed? or Is she being spoon fed the information by her "gift?" Enoch obviously doesn't know anything until he gets it from Robin, so the answers reside with her and/or her gift. And yes, like you, I hope the writers/show runners properly flesh this out. i think that Robin just paints (or uses other means of communication) of whatever she sees. I do think she is spoon fed and I don't. Her mother told them that past, present and future is all one and the same to her. So I think she sees what she sees. But when Fitz asked her the question she immediately answered with the painting (she probably saw that question coming, just like she saw the agents coming). |
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Post by Hari Seldon on Dec 28, 2017 2:28:16 GMT
I rewatched 'Rewind' and now I'm confused. If Robin's first prophecy is what led to Enoch sending the team to 2091 and leaving Fitz behind, then what was the point of her second prophecy about him saving the team? Something must have changed in the future to warrant the second prophecy? Is anyone else confused? There is only one prophecy. And with the last drawing of Robin where Fitz is needed to save the team he becomes a part of that prophecy. In short: The team saves the world and Fitz saves the team. So, Enoch helps him now too. Yup Is Robin holding on to vital information until it's needed? or Is she being spoon fed the information by her "gift?" Enoch obviously doesn't know anything until he gets it from Robin, so the answers reside with her and/or her gift. And yes, like you, I hope the writers/show runners properly flesh this out. i think that Robin just paints (or uses other means of communication) of whatever she sees. I do think she is spoon fed and I don't. Her mother told them that past, present and future is all one and the same to her. So I think she sees what she sees. But when Fitz asked her the question she immediately answered with the painting (she probably saw that question coming, just like she saw the agents coming). Sorry (but not very) for those who don't get the reference, but her visions could be something like the Intersect in the series Chuck. In the show, the alphabet soup agencies of the government encoded all their intelligence into subliminal messages within images and the title character gets exposed to those images, so all that information is in his head, but he can't just recall it at will. When he sees or hears a particular thing it can set off a flash of information in his head and he knows about that one thing. (good series, watch it) Anyway, the point is that perhaps she sees someone walk past her holding an apple and gets the vision of the two investigators searching the kitchen and eating an apple or something similar. She may not have known the role Fitz played until perhaps she saw his picture on the television or on the front page of a newspaper after he escaped. |
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Post by caseyrook AKA Mechelle on Dec 28, 2017 2:30:29 GMT
There is only one prophecy. And with the last drawing of Robin where Fitz is needed to save the team he becomes a part of that prophecy. In short: The team saves the world and Fitz saves the team. So, Enoch helps him now too. Yup i think that Robin just paints (or uses other means of communication) of whatever she sees. I do think she is spoon fed and I don't. Her mother told them that past, present and future is all one and the same to her. So I think she sees what she sees. But when Fitz asked her the question she immediately answered with the painting (she probably saw that question coming, just like she saw the agents coming). Sorry (but not very) for those who don't get the reference, but her visions could be something like the Intersect in the series Chuck. In the show, the alphabet soup agencies of the government encoded all their intelligence into subliminal messages within images and the title character gets exposed to those images, so all that information is in his head, but he can't just recall it at will. When he sees or hears a particular thing it can set off a flash of information in his head and he knows about that one thing. (good series, watch it) Anyway, the point is that perhaps she sees someone walk past her holding an apple and gets the vision of the two investigators searching the kitchen and eating an apple or something similar. She may not have known the role Fitz played until perhaps she saw his picture on the television or on the front page of a newspaper after he escaped. Sort of how Raina didn't get her 'visions' of Ultron until Coulson told Hill to assemble the Avengers over a video call. |
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I'll be spending next weekend with some family I like and trying to avoid any remotely controversial conversations with others that I spend the rest of the year avoiding 